who is/is-not 'moderating' this crap? ... &/or 'self-[andOther]indulgence[s]' vs 'self-censorship' ...

From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Wed Nov 6, 2002  11:24 am
Subject:  Re: B-Grade Stuff
Who is moderating this crap?

+++++

From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Wed Nov 6, 2002  12:39 pm
Subject:  Re: B-Grade Stuff

Come on to the sands ... and there join hands ... for more
beachcombings ... [or is it just another hokey cokey dance?] ...

You never know who or what you might find there ...

By the way of introductions ...

Pleased to meet you ... hope you soon forget my name ...

In cases of mistaken identity it is generally assumed to be the case
that one person's identity is somehow and for some reason
msappropriated and handed over to some other person ...
sometimes, however, as if for amusement, The
Fates/moira/chance/imagination/consillyance/call-it-what-you-will
conspires/just-happens to compound many identities into one jolly big
guffaw of a misunderstanding ... or into something else entirely ...

Looking down a wishing well ... watching splashy trashy reflections
of self-celebrants as they kiss'n'tell ...
Or ... watching the tired muscles twitch for an old-time itch ...
Or ... the fucking former prime minister fucked with the fucking
former health minister ... and ... hell had no fury like a spicey
sounding tale teller with a holiday home to pay for with royalties
from a life-story that was actually rather tedious really when she
thought about it in midlife early-waking depressive morning thoughts
[we all get 'em] ...

Meanwhile ...
... some go through rather move eventful episodes ... and rather wish
they should not have ought to have been forced to go through that
sort of thing ...
Johnny survived the so-called Great War ... and somme said he was
sort of shelshoked on the some ...
... and Johnny said afterwards that the war he had been through had
not been so great and that he was now more or less just contented
enough in some sort of way just to be alive still and able to drink
some wine and take some walks and write the odd bit of nonsense,
which was not perhaps so nonsensical, under a sandy dancing sort of
pseudonym ...
.. and the crap that was written and said about him by others was
unbelievable sometimes ...
Johnny, who had a few airs and graces, but was just another plain old
British Tommy really, knew he was shocked rightly enough ...
... by the severed body parts and the rivers of blood-and-mud and the
endless seeming weeks of waiting and worrying and occasionally being
ordered to do the most unspeakable of things [which he never would
talk about afterwards, fully, completely ...] ... and lots of other
things too numerous to mention ... and not forgetting the shells that
were designed to shock him ... and even blown him to bits ... as they
did do his mates ... and how would he ever forget them? ... and not
be shocked forever afterwards ...
How shameful it is sometimes to reflect on the fact that one's own
confessional is gorssly lacking in truly terrible detail ...
One night young Pip [who had great expectations but just wasn't up to
it] and Ms Catharsis [a sort of comical catastrophe who never came]
trespassed technically when they strayed drunkenly, with no real
criminal intent, off Fleet Street, without full press passes, into
the previously rather highly esteemed offices of Big and Fat, Asian
Babes, 40-Plus ... and the Daily Express [wherein the pages of which,
as John Cooper Clarke, the poet laurette of a losing generation of
small-time-small-place mostly harmless surrealists, put it: you'll
never see even the littlest of nipples] ... And no one questioned
their rights to be there, and wandering about freely, because in
circus-land it seemed to be the case that if you looked the part and
acted it convincingly, then your role-playing was taken as
successful ...
John Cameron Audrey Bingham Michael Morgan [JB for short] strayed off
Fleet Street one night into a novle by A.G. Macdonnell [AG for
short]... and into a pub ...
... In a sudden whirl of rage he seized an enormous thick walking
stick, or rather cudgel, which leant on the counter beside him, and
struck the counter a terrific blow which set the galsses jumping and
rattling, and he shouted, "Stinking fish! Is there no one here to
serve a gentleman?"
No one thought anything amiss - Johnny was shell-shocked in
the 'great' war, of course ..
Writing the expressive meandering beachy wandering column day after
day after day was a strain on Johnny ... but better than killing
people for a living ...
And he deserved a good drink after a hard day's work ... was there no
one there to serve a gentle man with a small act of kindness - or at
least another drink?
Johnny wrote a cascade of melody from the old larnd and in many a
fenny dell the shy lesser celandine and a flash of wings announces
the arrival of the tiny beercrest by tilth and loam spring's sweet
messangers, e.g. ...
Some objected that it seemed that JB's rough notes had gotten mixed
up with his polished copy.
He replied: 'It is no matter. The public likes a glimpse of the
writer's workshop.'

[Another wondered, by the way - and with more than passing interest -
, whether those following in the footsteps of the previous comber of
beaches knew as much of the columnists' traditions as they perhaps
ought to have known.]

This is literal matter of fact:
Timothy Shy was DBWL who was Mustard and Cress who was At the Sign of
the Blue Moon who was Beachcomber who was Wyndham Lewis and JB anbd
many other too numerous to name, at this moment, in person.
The Oxford Companion to English Literature once said this of Wyndham
Lewis: 'Not to be confused with Wyndham Lewis.'
It was not a paradox or great mystery - there were, of course, two
Wyndham Lewis named human beings writing something approaching
literature at much the same time. One was an American-born essayist,
poet, novelist, painter and near-fascist [and all in one person!].
The other was a Daily Express columnist - first of the Beachcomber
frachise holders - and, in his spare time, biographer of several
leading catholics.
The dangers of a mis-spent youth ... when one should have been out
roistering, one was staying at home reading books ... and
becoming 'too knowing' for the general good ...
Mr Shy has from time to time been entertained by rich women .. but
not very many.
Once, on being nodded to by the philosopher Professor Joad, in the
lavatory of the Athenaeum Club (3.28pm, 18/07/32, wash-basin no. 5),
in mistake, as it turned out later, Mr Shy at once abandoned
literature, and took up big-time thinking in a big way ...
... or so, for a while, he thought ...
... appearance and reality ... the only real philosophical issue some
said ... but was it just a potty pottering game of one-
upppersonship? ... or something like that ...
"Kindly say clearly please whether the ball was in or out."
Whether Professor Joad's comment on the tennis court was a
philosophical point, a crass piece of ungentlemanly gamesmanship, or
the birth of a minor classic of comical English literature was a
question Stephen - or was that Steven? - never really resolved to his
satisfaction ...
And ... maybe the self-confessed piss artist was merely taking the
piss ...
[To true philosphers, all possibilities have to be considered ... in
good faith ...]

Wonderful London ... anything might happen there ...
The loveliest policewoman in London bent wonderingly over the greying
dissolute head of the apparent gentleman who lay before her in the
gutter - ashen-pale, his eyes part-closed ...
Her indescribable iridescent eyes were suddenly wide with dismay
under the street lights ...
'Frogprinceman!' she cried, as if remembering a name ...
The adorable law enforcer's surprizing cry awoke some sense of
recognition in the fallen male ...
'Mother!'
And so ... unheeding of the traffic which roared near by them ... the
Titian-haired maternal-type being [how could she be adequately
described?] ... and just another drunken fucking motherfucker [Note
to queasy literary scholars, and others: ... this is a street scene,
so use of language that might be labelled 'of the street' is to some
extent justifiable - judgements of quality, positive or negative, are
not, of course, to be rushed to by the careful scholar ...] ... met
up for ... a beautifully sublime timeless moment of iconographic
significance ...
Or ... blue beat bitch pondered tenderly the plight of the prone
strangely charming man ...
Or ... Her Majesty's finest female peripatetic constabulatory
countenance sighed at the sight of another stupid sodden shit ...
Or ... without any emotion she did her job ... and called for
assistance on the wankie tankie communication system ... and a couple
of careless coppers cleared up the bit of comatose crap ...
London, London ... what a heartbreak old town you are ...
But where should the apostrophe go in all that? ...
And so beechcomer continued ...
... one word after another ...
... with fairly decent grammar, and good, sound spelling ...
... and proper words in proper places [as swift Johnny probably
rightly observed - in between his gullyvanting travels - was the true
definition of a good style] ...
... and not looking kindly [or should that be "kindily"?] on people
who put personal ambition before the general good ...
... but not really condemning them either ...

+++++
From:  "Mike Krug" <mkrug28@h...>
Date:  Wed Nov 6, 2002  1:37 pm
Subject:  Re: [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
To what crap might you be referring, Phil? If it is your swirling
soliloquies of spellbinding speech, said to satiate the soul(I can write
purty too!), then I see no need for moderation. If you refer to moderating
the group as a whole, by keeping topics going along a philosophical line in
relation to Heraclitus, who is to say that your prose is not pertinent? If,
however, you are referring to the supreme moderation of the worldly events
taking place around us, then I join you in your quest for the Cartesian
'evil genius' whose goal is to screw with my mind! I, for one, would be
greatly receptive to discussions involving the namesake of the
group(Heraclitus for the uninitiated), while imploring you to keep your
wonderful writings ever flowing into our stream of consciousness.
Pleasantly,
Mike
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Thu Nov 14, 2002  2:32 pm
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
Dear Mike
Thanks for your kind words of support and fellow feeling. Perhaps I
have my inspired moments, everyone does - but a fair proportion of
what I write must be crap. I would like to see other people
chattering here - on Herclitus, or any other matter. On the other
hand (and there usually is one!) ... this is a quiet backwater, where
I can ramble away to myself and to who knows how many others [Yahoo
statistics never seem very precise], without causing too much
disturbance to the wider schemes of things.
As for the 'genius' [out 'there' and beyond comprehension - and I am
not really inclined to think 'it' an 'evil' one] ... I dunno ...
Perhaps ... 'it' was in some way lonely when one [with nothing beyond
itself] ... and so split itself into many ... but bits of the many,
in isolation from each other, were in some sense lonely and longing
to be reunited into some greater oneness ... but then ... [and so
on] ... perhaps ...
Thanks again.
Best wishes (and yours ever questingly)
Philip.
--- In heraclitussociety@y..., "Mike Krug" <mkrug28@h...> wrote:
> To what crap might you be referring, Phil? If it is your swirling
> soliloquies of spellbinding speech, said to satiate the soul(I can
write
> purty too!), then I see no need for moderation. If you refer to
moderating
> the group as a whole, by keeping topics going along a philosophical
line in
> relation to Heraclitus, who is to say that your prose is not
pertinent? If,
> however, you are referring to the supreme moderation of the worldly
events
> taking place around us, then I join you in your quest for the
Cartesian
> 'evil genius' whose goal is to screw with my mind! I, for one,
would be
> greatly receptive to discussions involving the namesake of the
> group(Heraclitus for the uninitiated), while imploring you to keep
your
> wonderful writings ever flowing into our stream of consciousness.
> Pleasantly,
> Mike
+++++
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  11:32 am
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
At a risk of offending 50+% [but what difference does it make?] ...
... heard it said that sisters are doing it for themselves ... hope
they know what they are doing ... doubt it somehow [seems to involve
some certain lack of humility] ...
'no matter'
[... bad faith bullshit merchants of the world unite ... you have
nothing to lose but your self-indulgent pass-times ... and your
rather somewhat superior assumptions ...]
+++++
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  11:43 am
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
... got this great idea ... borrowed it from the Nazis ... [and the
liberals] ... let's treat each other as if we were worthless pieces
of shit ...
'no matter'
+++++
--- In heraclitussociety@y..., "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...> wrote:
> ... go on ... wreck it for the sake of fucking wrecking it you
> cunts ...
+++++
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  12:21 pm
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
... let us leave it to the experts ...
... they fucking know it ... don't they ... eh?!

+++++
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  11:32 am
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff

At a risk of offending 50+% [but what difference does it make?] ...
... heard it said that sisters are doing it for themselves ... hope
they know what they are doing ... doubt it somehow [seems to involve
some certain lack of humility] ...
'no matter'
[... bad faith bullshit merchants of the world unite ... you have
nothing to lose but your self-indulgent pass-times ... and your
rather somewhat superior assumptions ...]
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  11:43 am
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff

... got this great idea ... borrowed it from the Nazis ... [and the
liberals] ... let's treat each other as if we were worthless pieces
of shit ...
'no matter'

From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  12:17 pm
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
... go on ... wreck it for the sake of fucking wrecking it you
cunts ...
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Fri Nov 22, 2002  12:21 pm
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
... let us leave it to the experts ...
... they fucking know it ... don't they ... eh?!
From:  "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
Date:  Sun Nov 24, 2002  10:49 am
Subject:  [Heraclitus Society] Re: B-Grade Stuff
--- In heraclitussociety@y..., "Philip Talbot" <philtal_uk@y...>
wrote:
> ... let us leave it to the experts ...
> ... they fucking know it ... don't they ... eh?!
... sometimes they do ... somethings they don't ...

+++++
Date: 24 Nov 2002 18:47:35 -0000
From: "heraclitussociety Moderator" <heraclitussociety-owner@yahoogroups.com>  Add to Address Book
To: philtal_uk@yahoo.com
Subject: Welcome to heraclitussociety 
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Date: 27 Dec 2002 20:26:03 -0000
From: "Heraclitus Moderator" <Heraclitus-owner@yahoogroups.com>  Add to Address Book
To: philtal_uk@yahoo.com
Subject: Welcome to Heraclitus 
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To: Heraclitus@yahoogroups.com
From: "Philip Talbot <philtal_uk@yahoo.com>" <philtal_uk@yahoo.com>  Add to Address Book
Date: Fri, 27 Dec 2002 20:27:23 -0000
Subject: Re: what folly
   
--- In Heraclitus@yahoogroups.com, "vanni" <lucif666vanni@y...> wrote:
> i wonder why there is no dicent nietzche group

... because he ain't quite up to it ...
Date: Sun, 29 Dec 2002 03:07:27 -0800 (PST)
From:  "ivan debono" <lucif666vanni@yahoo.com>  Add to Address Book
Subject: Re: what folly
To: "Philip Talbot <philtal_uk@yahoo.com>" <philtal_uk@yahoo.com>
--- "Philip Talbot <philtal_uk@yahoo.com>"
<philtal_uk@yahoo.com> wrote:
> ... because ... all things said and done ... he was
> not in the first
> rank of philosphers ...
>
> --- In Heraclitus@yahoogroups.com, "vanni"
> <lucif666vanni@y...> wrote:
> > i wonder why there is no dicent nietzche group
>
That is your opinion i think nietzche is one of the
best thinkers ever
+++++